Elon Musk's X is now banned in Brazil | Mashable.
Elon Musk's X is now banned in Brazil
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| Brazil's top court just banned Elon Musk's social media platform X from the country. Credit: Jaap Arriens/NurPhoto via Getty Images |
Brazil just gave Elon Musk's X the boot.
On Friday, Brazil's top court ordered that Musk's social media company X, formerly known as Twitter, be banned in the country.
The move comes after Musk has feuded with Brazilian Supreme Court justice Alexandre de Moraes, who has previously ordered that X remove content that spread fake news and misinformation. Musk and company classified the judge's requests as "censorship orders."
Musk himself has recently attacked the judge on X, calling Moraes an "evil dictator."
Tweet may have been deleted
Earlier this month, X closed its operations in Brazil, alleging that the judge threatened X representative Rachel Nova Conceicao with arrest if the company did not comply with the content removal orders.
While X the company exited Brazil, the platform still remained available and accessible to users in the country. On Wednesday, Brazil's Supreme Court ordered X to appoint a legal representative in the country within 24 hours. Failing to do so, X shared a statement on Thursday night anticipating a potential ban.
"Soon, we expect Judge Alexandre de Moraes will order X to be shut down in Brazil – simply because we would not comply with his illegal orders to censor his political opponents," the statement reads.
Losing its user base in Brazil will likely hurt X. The platform is popular in the country, with Brazilian users accounting for tens of millions of X's monthly active user base.
As the New York Times reports, many of the accounts that Judge Moraes ordered suspended belonged to supporters of Brazil's former right-wing president Jair Bolsonaro. Some of the accounts that were ordered to be removed questioned the results of Brazil's 2022 election, which Bolosonaro lost.
Brazil requires that tech companies have a legal representative located within the country in order to operate there. The country has previously banned platforms, such as Telegram in 2022, for failing to comply with local laws. (Telegram has since resumed operating in Brazil.)
On Thursday, one of Elon Musk's other companies, the SpaceX-affiliated Starlink, shared that Brazil's Supreme Court had frozen the company's finances. Starlink's statement claims that the judge did so after he had determined that Starlink should be responsible for fines against Musk's X.
Topics Social Media Twitter Elon Musk Politics
Alexandre de Moraes confirmed nazi
ReplyDeleteWhat Brazilians will quickly find out after three or four days without Twitter is that they’re not actually missing anything, and if the service is dark long enough to shed the addiction, Elon Musk will risk losing a significant number of users permanently.
ReplyDeleteIt is tough when there is a visible showdown with two very flawed characters as the antagonists. On one side the world’s richest aggrieved reactionary, on the other a partisan hack with very little gravitas for his authority from a place with limited tradition of free speech, freedom of the press, lawfulness, democracy. Sad and visible example of how social media and crumbling institutions reflect ever more a medieval , dark ages-like public square. Wishing both of them lose big time from this fracas.
ReplyDeleteWow - sounds like a country complying with common sense, doing its bit to reverse internet madness. But to really assess the rights and wrongs of what Justice Moraes is doing - those orders need to be unsealed at least to a wider panel of unbiased judges in Brazil, who should add their voices if they agree. One on one in a fight like this seems too much of a human burden, and only breeds suspicion of bias.
ReplyDeleteRemember when Bowie was asked about the Internet? That’s right, it’s not just The Village Voice personal ads.
ReplyDeleteThere are now far better alternatives than the cess pit that Musk has turned X into. Musk's loss is Brazil's gain.
ReplyDeleteThe huge problem with X (twitter) is that just about anyone (and probably millions of bots, as well) can express just about any *opinion* and that be considered as valid as verifiable facts and the opinion of actual experts if you agree with that opinion. What this does is destroy any value that learning, education, science and proper journalism has. That certainly doesn't seem good for democracy and civilization. Surprisingly though, with avoiding anything even remotely political on the site, which is possible, I do still like Twitter - I just wish it had a better owner.
ReplyDeleteNote that this order also requires VPNs to be removed from the app stores. It’s objectively an authoritarian overreach. The fact that there are no checks to this particular judge is an egregious example of how freedom and democracy can fail for the sake of allegedly protecting democracy.
ReplyDeleteHow can this happen in a country like Brazil?
ReplyDeleteWe the people of the United States are powerless in the face of Private Sector Business.
In the Age of FDR We the people, through our elected representatives and Government, we’re in control and Private Sector Businesses were forced to operate with some minimal regard for the public interest.
Now in the Age of Reagan and with the Citizens United ruling we the people have turned power over to the Private Sector.
The United States lags behind Brazil now and we could learn a lot from them.
I never saw this coming, Brazil the leader of the Free World.
I know it feels so uneasy criticizing free speech that we kind of prefer the power of old nation states regulators than the power of big corporations and their unelected managers. I still believe there is still a chance for a better global democratic future, for sure with regulations. Even a Tesla needs road lines and stop signs.
ReplyDeleteI am not tech savvy but why are there no real alternatives to X or Meta, established in this country and other countries? (I am talking about serious competitors not the Trump like social media.) This country and the world needs to get away from a handful of people dictating the terms of how people can interact, and there should be a lot more choices of social media networks that can accomplish the same aims and goals as the popular social media systems presently existing. (Instagram, X, Meda,, etc.)
ReplyDeleteBecause audience. Todays world wants maximum audience for maximum capitalization at the maximum rate possible. Good for a few pocketbooks, maybe, but not so good for culture or society.
DeleteX has blocked liberal accounts in countries like India so obviously this is not about free speech but protecting conservative and hateful voices like his own.
ReplyDeleteThis article describes Musk as a believer in absolute freedom, but he has certainly been willing to censor posts that are not right wing.
ReplyDeleteHe does not deserve to be viewed as a person who believes in expansive rights.
Wonder how much, probably not much, the US State Department paid him to do this? Watch for other countries to follow suit. We can't afford to lose those regions in Ukraine because big US and UK corporations have stock in their resources. Censorship for minerals.
ReplyDeleteWow, why give a judge such expansive powers?
ReplyDeleteMusk’s free speech absolutism has turned out to be an absolute philosophical, financial and commercial doom.
ReplyDeleteIt's been obvious from the beginning that Mr. Musk does not have any idea how social networks work, and that the majority of users want some protection from vile content and particularly Twitter was seen as a verified source of information.
ReplyDeleteHe lost users, he lost advertisers and it looks more likely that his increasingly erratic behavior may become a threat for his other businesses like Starlink, Tesla and Space X, rather than improving Twitter (oddly renamed X).
It is hard to take his commitment to free speech seriously since he had no problem removing a BBC documentary in India, so he seems more committed to right wing alternative facts. It also looks like UK and EU have issues with X’s dubious content as well, so I feel bad for X stock owners.
I share Mr. Paulson's sentiments below. It is overwhelming how many people commenting here have an aversion to freedom. Further, no one forces anyone to read what is on X or other social media nor is anyone forced to agree or not agree with any of its content. So, why all the hand wringing?
ReplyDeleteMusk is a hero. The media is supposed to objectively report on people in power to protect the public from corruption and misuse of power. Because much of thr mainstream media has not been doing his, people are turning to other sources of news.
ReplyDeleteHe is protecting freedom of speech. X/Twitter is so much better. Users can leave notes about misinformation which is attached to posts.
Until the media regains it’s professionalism and stops slamming it’s biased views down the public’s fault, the X’s protection of the freedom of speech is needed.
The Brazil judge is way out of line. He was to cancel political opponents of the government. Power leads to a hunger for more power.
ReplyDeleteI grew up in a pre Tweet world & encourage people to explore the joys of writing a letter.
ReplyDeleteElon has been pining for this moment. A country big enough to really make it noticed but not an existential threat to the bottom line of X. Now he will give Brazil the big finger and claim a win for free speech. Depending on the particulars of this case, he may even be right.
ReplyDeleteIt’s disturbing to see the overwhelming support in these comments for the suppression of free speech. Adults in a free society need to live in a world where other people say despicable things. Many readers here are cheering for going down the path of Chinese state control of thoughts and ideas.
ReplyDeleteGood. This is exactly what Elon Musk needs - accountability. I fervently hope it hurts his business. Musk censors anyone he disagrees with including NPR here in the USA. It's time America imposes some common sense restrictions on the kinds of lies, especially political and health related lies, that Musk amplifies on Twitter, (yeah, yeah I know).
ReplyDeleteBoth Musk and the Murdoch empire should be regulated. FOX should be banned entirely.
"Several authoritarian governments have banned X, including China, Russia, Iran and North Korea. "
ReplyDeleteIf China, Russia, Iran and North Korea are blocking you, you're doing something right. Note that Russia only began blocking X after Musk took over; the others were blocked when X was still Twitter, some time ago.
"He has ordered X to remove at least 140 accounts, most of them right-wing, including some of Brazil's most prominent conservative pundits and members of Congress."
Musk is a hero if he continues to stand up to this. How long before someone invents some charges and arrests him, just like the Telegraph guy? It sounds like he would be arrested if he went to Brazil for sure.
Watch Sacha Baron Cohen's speech to the ADL (it's found easily online). Tells you all you need to know about social media and the need to regulate.
ReplyDeleteElon Musk fancies himself a modern day William Randolph Hearst, making up the news as it suits him to acomplish his political ends and undermine democratic norms and nations wherever they get in his way. Now, more than ever, social media, and especially X, needs strong regulatory restraint to protect us all from Musk's worst instincts, now unfettered by any reasonable respect for truth telling and the rule of law.
ReplyDeleteSo, does 'democracy' and free speech mean normalizing the dark web? If we follow his logic, posts inciting human trafficking, drug use, unregulated weapons, animal torture, and terrorism should all be protected under free speech. And what about content promoting pedophilia or inciting violence? According to this billionaire's reasoning, everyone should have the right to decide what they consume online. But if we take this argument to its extreme, we'd eventually argue that laws themselves are anti-democratic because they restrict our freedom to do whatever we please.
ReplyDeletehonestly? We lived without it before and we were fine.No one will miss it.
ReplyDeleteI haven't followed this story in great detail BUT I'm always pleased whenever I see the overbearing power of the very dangerous Elon Musk being curtailed in any way. It's frightening to contemplate that a man could accumulate such grotesque amounts of money and then use the influence that comes with such vast wealth to the detriment of society, as Musk has continued to do. I will say that there are aspects of what's happening in Brazil with freedom of speech at the hands of the judge, who is taking on Musk, that appear troubling on the surface. Still, I approve of the exercise of power by the Brazilian government in curtailing the influence of Musk and his (un)social network. Generally speaking, a mark against Musk is a win for the rest of us.
ReplyDeleteThe first five words of the 1st Amendment are, “Congress shall make no law”…
ReplyDeleteThis protection only has to do with governments; it has no bearing on private employers or companies.
No matter how much Musk thinks that social media platforms violate freedom of speech rights, they have no constitutional duty to uphold such rights.
These are private companies and they have absolutely no obligation to host any user they believe is problematic.
It is revolting to see Americans commenting here wishing the same thing would happen in the United States. Like it or not our First Amendment is the strongest protector of free speech in the world. For that reason everyone should be extremely grateful nothing like what is occurring in Brazil could ever happen in the United States.
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
ReplyDeleteTwitter was required by Brazilian law to censor certain kinds content, including blatantly false information and conspiracy to violently overthrow the brazilian government.
ReplyDeleteElon Musk took over Twitter, fired the content moderation team and is refusing to delete anything illegal. As a result, he is being fined, which he has been refusing to pay.
This man needs to be taught that he is not above countries' laws.
Good. And the health of the country will dramatically improve starting tomorrow.
ReplyDeleteI'm Brazilian and I can say that there is no debate about what can or cannot be said. The debate is that the platform refused to comply with valid court orders.
ReplyDeleteThe decisions that X/Twitter refused to comply with involve the suspension of accounts of people who threatened federal police officers and posted photos of their families on social media, as well as people who encouraged people to plant bombs in airports and kill ministers of our Supreme Court.
Imagine if this happened anywhere in the world.
Good job, Brazil. Twitter has gone from 'global town square ' to toXic toy for a billionaire. Time to close this platform for good and for all and start somewhere anew.
ReplyDelete"the billionaire’s efforts to transform the site into a digital town square where just about anything goes."
ReplyDeleteThere is no town square where anything goes. Not even in the US where the right to free speech is enshrined— but not absolute. And not even on X, where Musk has banned certain terms (that he doesn’t like), and flight trackers (because he deems that a security threat — to billionaires).
Ultimately, he’s just another rich kid like Trump, who wants the rules to apply to others, but not to him.
"An escalating fight between Musk and a judge".
ReplyDeleteMusk, Trump and Durov are used to having their way by ignoring or rigging the judiciary. That needs to come to an end.
The judge -- which is to say the rule of law, must win.
The world would be better off without social media. Unfortunately it’s too late for that and we’re stuck with it. I’ll never understand why anyone wastes their time on Twitter.
ReplyDeleteThe reference to shouting "Fire!" in a crowded theater appears quite frequently in these comments, but the equivalency is simply not there. The resulting panic from a false shout of "Fire!' could easily cause injuries and death.
ReplyDeleteHow does expressing an opinion with which you disagree cause panic and injuries or death? Even if the opinion were faulty, who determines whether it's a lie? If I state 2+2=5, I'm not lymg if I truly believe it to be true. Just because 2 people hold opposite opinions doesn't mean one is lying and the other is honest. Invalid accusations of racism or hate speech are often made by political opponents who do it to score political points and possibly win an election. They aren't the most reliable source of information.
People also seem to always refer to Elon Musk as a billionaire as if that means he must be dishonest or have ulterior motives. That's nonsense to me.
We used to admire achievement in the country- not denigrate someone for his wealth. That's Marxism which has no place in ty US
There's no hero in this mess. Yes, Elon is certainly not fighting for democracy and freedom of speech. OTOH Moraes has turned into this weird situation where he's become a judicial dictator . He's breaking the Brazilian Constitution and the basic process of law in several occasions, including this action against X and Elon Musk. Of course, as the article states, the extreme left and the Government which is friendly with Russia, China , Cuba and Venezuela are really happy with him because he's doing the dirty work for them. Poor democracy and freedom of speech who are just props for these two.
ReplyDeleteGood for justice Moraes. Unlike the U.S. post-Trump, Brazil post-Bolsanaro has taken real, tangible, effective steps to protect democracy. Maybe its most important aspect is simply to show that a democratic government has the will to defend itself against fascism.
ReplyDeleteAs an aside, I wonder what Musk's relationships, business and otherwise, are with Russia.
Musk's definition of free speech is whatever fits his idea of ruling the world.
ReplyDeleteI am not kidding.
We need to go back to the Fairness Doctrine. When the FCC had power to ensure the community received good information. What a concept.
ReplyDeleteHow much security risk is it, using X?
ReplyDeleteThey required an email address to set up my X account, which I use solely to follow certain reputable organizations and public figures, mostly academics.
I never post or repost. I have literally never typed a single word or created a profile—I just use the screen name X assigned to me.
Soon after, the email account I gave them began receiving tons of spam, which has continued every day since.
Most of it is posing as being from well known corporations that someone like myself might do business with, but by hovering over the return email it’s just an individual. I know not to reply or follow links.
I had used this email account daily for 18 years with little to no spam.
Any knowledge would be appreciated.
It’s a day like this reading so many uninformed comments about what free speech is here that I give thanks to the United States Consritution and its 1sr Amendment. No folks, it is not a crime in the US to lie, spread “misinformation,” propagandize or use hate speech. Why? Because the Framers knew these concepts would be abused by autocrats who wanted to imprison their political opponents and crush dissenting opinions. You may not like “hate speech” (I don’t) but the laws that protect it are what make this country great and protect your freedoms whether you know it or not. Brazilian leadership is abusing the rights of its citizens to crush its politics oppositions. But they lack a true democracy and strong constitution. Sad day for human rights everywhere.
ReplyDeleteI'm continually amazed at how many people think the first amendment covers any entity other than the government. Musk and Zuckerman and the rest of them have every right to censor whatever they want on their platforms. They are not the government. The first amendment protects speech from censorship by the government not by private entities.
ReplyDeleteThey always claim that they can't control/ censor speech on their platforms. They most certainly can. The same applies to private universities that have every right to shut down protests if they are disruptive. There is no law stating that a private entity cannot censor speech.
Musk and his fellow travelers completely misunderstand the principle of free speech. It exists to protect those who would speak truth to power. It does not, as Justice Holmes so succinctly put it, allow people to falsely shout “fire!” inside a crowded theatre. But that is exactly what Twitter is being used to do - to cynically transmit calculated incitements to very damaging mob behavior. Free speech is not about letting anyone say anything any time they like. It’s about the protection of free speakers. Those who have the courage to point out when the emperor has no clothes. It is not there to protect the cowards that lurk behind social media aliases and work their poison into the public discourse.
ReplyDeleteSome people say that freedom of speech is what's at stake here. That is incorrect. While authoritarian regimes supress X and other media for their own dictatorial purposes, it can be legitimate for a democracy to regulate social or other media, especially- no, only- if such entities begin to sow the types of misinformation and confusion that threaten a nation's social or political fabric. That's good government, employed in an attempt to stop bad men or power grabbers from threatening freedoms under the guise of being free speech loving.
ReplyDeleteIf only we could do that here. There are downsides to the first amendment.
ReplyDeleteIt was once called paranoia. Now, it's our reality. Spying and censorship. Bigtime power in the hands of personalities who reveal to us everyday that they, too, don't know how to proceed. It would all be so much more fun for our kids and edifying for adults, particularly the elderly, if we didn't have so much to ignore.
ReplyDeleteValor. Honor. Who will uphold you? How long can our best hold out under the twenty-four hour lights of a salad bar in Vegas?
Old Timer: Well, son, that's up to Elon, I guess.
Oh, dear. What will Brazilians do with themselves if they can't wile away the hours on X?!
ReplyDeleteI can't even imagine... maybe go for a walk and touch grass? Is it still a thing?
DeleteI know this may seem petty, but it’s visceral: I react to Musk’s photo the same as I do to trump’s visage (and Junior Kennedy’s voice): I immediately switch to some thing else
ReplyDeleteAgreed. I cannot fathom why the Times uses this photo of Musk. It reminds me of the ridiculous AI trading cards Trump extols.
DeleteMusk intends to “allow the massive spread of disinformation, hate speech and attacks on the democratic rule of law, violating the free choice of the electorate, by keeping voters away from real and accurate information.”
ReplyDeleteYes, sounds about right. In the words of my Jamaican friends, Musk is a monkey with a shotgun.
Brazilians should join Truth Social and get an honest look at America and the world.
ReplyDeleteAs the article says, Brazil joins the storied ranks of China, Russia, Iran and North Korea. Congratulations.
ReplyDeleteIt's doubly funny is trying to spitefully hit back at Starlink, a totally different company, despite the country's schools and MILITARY using Starlink. Cue Musk saying "We'll keep providing it for free, because we know you have no alternative." Because this isn't about "X" - it is about Musk and about control.
And because this is all about Musk, and the hatred of him, I expect this sort of censorship will be a big hit here with a certain brand of commentator as well.
I'm agnostic on Musk. Did you read the article? The schools were never connected. It was marketing campaign. As is Musk's commitment to "Free Speech" on X. As soon as someone calls themselves a "Free Speech Absolutist" as Musk does, I know they don't understand the principles of free speech.
DeleteGreat news Elon! France has decided to present you with their Legion of Merit award. To collect, appear in person in Paris.
ReplyDeleteI wish everyone would. But you’d have to play whack a mole. There are lots of others out there.
ReplyDeleteMusk/vanity. Why can't extremely wealthy, old guys get decent hair dye jobs? (I no longer have enough hairs to bother dying if I were sufficiently vain.) Musk's dye job looks clownish, a common effect among vain, old men. And his Botox overdose -- that occupies a plateau of its own.
ReplyDeleteSanity prevails
ReplyDeleteWhite Dudes for Harris got suspended, the reinstated. Just enough time to stop donations and momentum. Can we believe Musk when he says he believes in free speech? Only if it's speech he wants....
ReplyDeleteDeleted my Twitter account a few days ago. Glad I never bought a Tesla. Certainly glad I never bought a Cybertruck. Twitter has become Elon Musk's private chat room. It is history.
ReplyDeleteFreedom for fascisms is the gambit and satellites the tool. Musk and Trump want to rule the world of information however fabricated and customized.
ReplyDeleteHe says the judge wasn't elected, so who elected him to be president of the galaxy?
ReplyDeleteA few years back he was considered a "real life Iron Man" but now we finally figured he's actually a real life Lex Luthor.
Greatest news just before the labor day weekend.
ReplyDeleteIndependent of Judge Moraes decision to ban "X" from Brazil, let this episode be a warning to arrogant Musk: hate speech, and lies, and a call for violence, on its platform is not really "free speech"...while confusing people and removing the beauty fo the Internet...in keeping us well informaed, based on the facts, and the truth. As it stands, Elon's behavior is despicable! And irresponsible! And so, oh so Trumpian it stinks!
ReplyDeleteWhen you do business in other countries you are a guest. When you go to other countries the U.S. doesn't have to rescue you if you get arrested.
ReplyDeleteLooks like a trend, first Telegram in France and now Elon Musk in Brazil.
Never act like your more important then your customers. Keep your political bats at home.
Isn't he the one who doesn't believe in workers rights, oh yeah only his rights are always right.
This is one of those headlines that makes me smile without reading a single word of the story.
ReplyDeleteFinally, someone showed guts to stand to Musk's nonsense. Hopefully, this strengthens Keir Starmer's government in the UK to bring that lawless person to senses.
ReplyDeleteOh, yeah. You can call me anti-American. That's perfectly fine. But I know the reality in our country—there is 'no political' force that can withstand the bully Musk. We are all 'gutless' in America. With our Supreme Court openly in pockets of deranged MAGA folks, there is nothing in our political discourse to rein in Musk & Trump.
That is why it is great that at least a few other countries have people with the political will to take on bullies like Musk.
This article was a pleasure to read.
ReplyDeleteGood for Brazil? Musk is a total hypocrite. He’s another man-child, much like Trump. He thinks he’s entitled. He bought Twitter because he was wrapped around the axel about free speech, but it’s really his own free speech that he’s worried about. He shuts down people for saying things he doesn’t like. He’s a billionaire so thinks he can do anything.
ReplyDeleteMay many more country's shut down this maniacal evil that keeps people in the constant turmoil of lies and hate.
ReplyDeleteHahaha. Flip the switch off EVERYWHERE. Musk and his money are a clear and present danger to all of humanity.
ReplyDeleteIsn't it a bit hypocritical to support disruptive Palestinian protestors as free speech while simultaneously calling for free speech limitations of others?
ReplyDeleteMusk banned cisgender? His rules are very weird. Doesn't sound free speechy to me.
ReplyDeleteAs a big data guy, I wouldn't have been caught dead on Twitter even before it was ... this.
ReplyDeleteIs it srsly true that you can't say cisgender on there?!?
Without X, where are Brazilians going to get their mis and disinformation from?
ReplyDelete" [ ... ] to transform the site into a digital town square where just about anything goes. [ ... ]"
ReplyDeleteReally? Anything goes in the town square? Where is that town? In some nihilist utopia?
An impartial observer might take issue with the transformation into a digital town square characterization. So far, it looks more like a dumpster fire no-one wants to put out.
Narcissistic Personality Disorder.
This article contains one very important fallacy. Musk is NOT trying to make X a place where anyone can say anything. He regularly bans people who post criticisms of himself or his policies. Musk is a hypocrite. He is not for Free Speech.
ReplyDeleteMusk is a free speech absolutist until someone hurts his feelings.
ReplyDeleteAmericans commenting on this without knowing anything about Alexandre de Morais are making a big mistake. Morais is an authoritarian wannabe dictator, appointed by the right-wing, zero-legitimacy ex-president Michel Temer, who took power following a parliamentary coup against the elected president Dilma Rousseff in 2016. Morais has ruled substantial parts of Brazilian society by decree since about 2022. He is not a hero of democracy.
ReplyDeleteIt's long past time to boycott social media
ReplyDeleteJeffrey Epstein sexually abused many teenagers. He behaved like that because he felt totally untouchable. His friends included some of the most powerful figures in America.
ReplyDeleteThe same way, Harvey Weinstein used to scream at people and sexually assaulted nearly a hundred women. When some women wanted to complain, he hired an army of spooks to go after them.
Elon Musk reminds me of Jeffrey Epstein and Harvey Weinstein. He genuinely believes he can get away with anything.
if a right wing judge decided to block google because they refused to take down accounts of liberal party leaders, would we be fine with that?
ReplyDeleteI personally say My House My Rules✨
ReplyDeleteIf you can't abide by the rules.... Exit Right. Leave.
X was asked to leave.
Hopefully this will happen more often as
X & Telegram love to pander in stirring up anarchy & then
throw up a legal defense to distance themselves from the misdemeanors & crimes.
X and all social media accounts should operate like the UK Hyde Park Speakers Corner. Identify yourself. Social media has allowed people to hide their identity and spread false information.
ReplyDeleteDemocracy and free speech was given to the world by the English - from the Magna Carta to the UK Bill of Rights, to the US Constitution - and from there it spread across the globe. Let's hold onto it. We still have lots of fascist countries like China and Russia where speech is curtained, and even India is struggling. But it shouldn't be in a democratic society.
Say what you want - identify yourself. And in a democratic society, the offended can reply or sue for libel.
Edwin Thompson
Park Ridge, New Jersey
that was exactly what the US govt was doing with Twitter before Musk bought it
ReplyDelete" increase in hate speech and misinformation since Musk took over."
ReplyDeleteMusk to his dad: "Look dad, I made the world a worst place to live in. Aren't you proud of me?"
If we as bleating sheep, are so dumb we can't discern the chaff from the wheat, then we deserve what we get from government censorship. If we can't handle the lies, then we can't handle the truth, and truly then we are mindless and helpless needing government to point us to the truth. Then we are doomed!
ReplyDelete“Free speech is the bedrock of democracy and an unelected pseudo-judge in Brazil is destroying it for political purposes,” Mr. Musk said on Friday.
ReplyDeleteSays the vagabond from South Africa. Donald Trump, who has made a career out of making enemies of everyone, and who probably should look over his shoulder for Dick Cheney from time to time, has a new understudy. Like Giuliani and Mike Lindell, the new self immolant apparently is perfectly willing to drag his companies' shareholders down the drain with him, in service of Charlie Manson 2.0.
I'm surprised. I figured the UK or the EU would be the first to block his "services." Brazil beat them to it. Good for them. Our SEC is useless. He should be blocked from running public companies in the United States. But "investors" are just served up for dinner by this government.
Fascism has found a friend in Elon Musk. If this were reversed, with democratic voices being censored for hate speech, he would hasten to comply. Too bad for Elon, the majority of the left don’t engage in hate speech.
ReplyDeleteGood luck suing the entire country, Elon.
ReplyDeleteIt’s about time someone stuck it to Elon Musk to remind him he’s as subject to the law of the land as we mere mortals.
ReplyDeleteNow, this is good news on a Friday! !
ReplyDeleteToxic billionaires need a comeuppance.
ReplyDeleteThank you Brazil for pulling the plug on X and Starlink.
must be friends with Biden and the democrat party
ReplyDelete"Disinformation" Similar to Facebook's recent admissions?
ReplyDeleteMusk is like Trump; He hates following orders or the law. It's my way or the highway, It's call respect not freedom Mr. Musk.
ReplyDeleteJust pay for a legal representative who lives in Brazil and the problem is solved. Or so it would seem.
ReplyDeletedown with oligarky malarkey
ReplyDeletelet him sue Brazil
ReplyDeleteNunca vi isso na minha vida, tempos interessantes de se estar vivo e tempos sombrios também
ReplyDeleteThis says much more about the Brazilian government than it says about Elon Musk and Twitter. The government of Brazil obviously needs to protect itself from the many, many supporters of Jair Bolsonaro, who thanks to the use of electronic voting machines has been found to have lost the elections.
ReplyDeleteThose in the U.S. cheering on the decision to ban X in Brazil would have happily cheered on 1933 Germany’s hard clamp-down on “misinformation.” Benjamin Franklin and his printing press were misinformation spreaders, too, in 1776 and before.On the left, free speech is just a tool for advancing the revolution, never a God-given natural right.
Businesses exist at the pleasure of society, with society's setting the table rules for those businesses to play in (whether virtual or not).
ReplyDeleteBlueSky, Threads and other alternatives to X will lap up those users very happily.
https://media.tenor.com/qAFZ_6WxiJ4AAAAC/shame-jerry-seinfeld.gif
ReplyDeleteBrazil (where I live) is under a dictatorship, sadly supported by many brazilians.
ReplyDeleteI'll be watching my Eagles on Friday as they play in Brazil. It's going to be interesting to see how the team / fans / beat writers / players get by with not being able to post on X.
ReplyDeleteHell yeh! It's gone. I just checked. Hope your country do the same. The South African rich teenager has to be shutdown for good.
ReplyDeleteMe when the leaders of the President's party use twitter after the ban but the citizens aren't allowed to #Democracy
ReplyDeletehttps://x.com/ptbrasil/status/1829866729755066887
It's probably a scheduled post
Deleteno they posted a few times after that too 😂 would be horrendous optics if they were all scheduled and the smm forgot
DeleteElon makes all of his companies all about him, he decides on a whim what will happen and who will get fired. So the corporate veil should be pierced: Musk should be personally liable for any debts incurred or crimes committed by his many companies, judges with stock in one should be considered to have stock in Elon Musk and recuse, Musk should go to jail for the harassment and incitements to violence on Twitter.
ReplyDeleteAmerica and Europe also suffer from the toxic effect of those people that even Jack Dorsey thought went beyond the pale.
Let’s keep the streak going.
ReplyDeleteEuropean Union next.
I want the little fascist musk to end talking to himself in his twitterers.
BTW- X is the 24th letter of the western alphabet. I am taking it back.
I'm so proud of my country 🇧🇷🇧🇷🇧🇷🇧🇷🇧🇷🥺
ReplyDeleteI would be too when EU does the same.
DeleteMisinformation is free speech for Musk and Trump.
ReplyDeleteIf anyone says anything against them, it will be a witch hunt.
And half the nation believes in these guys. Amazing. And the whole world laughs when it sees this kind of thing happening in the great democratic country.
Imagine if Musk started his own private schools...the only subject is how to out "animal farm" everyone else
ReplyDeleteI imagine it’d end as well as Trump U did.
DeleteHey, remember Elon's whole "it's not censorship if the government does it" when he was bending over for authoritarian governments last year? Funny how that changes when he doesn't like the government.
ReplyDeleteI wonder if Google and Apple will even try to allow VPNs to prove they are "filtering X" or just straight ban all VPNs in the Brazil stores. I think most VPNs would rather be banned and let people use them anyway than participate in the performance. The problem with banning foreign companies is there is no reason for them to care what the country thinks anymore. To see this through Brazil will have to go down the eventual end of their own splintered internet like China, Iran, etc
ReplyDeleteWhy are you spreading false fears? They've already changed their mind (and released an official amendment) about removing anything from app stores in case Twitter decides to comply and reinstate an official representative in Brazil. They will still fine you if you've been found to use Twitter via VPN though.
DeleteCan you link to the updated order? I'm referring to section 2.1 and 2.2 of the original order and how might a company react.
DeleteTOR browser will fix that BS.
ReplyDeleteNo one, outside of enthusiasts, has heard of the TOR browser.
DeleteWhat BS are you referring to? And if you are relying on Tor, perhaps your activities aren’t so above board.
DeleteCriminals love Tor but authorities still caught that Alaskan CSAM perp who was using it.
DeleteGood for them.
ReplyDeleteSpoken like a true fool.
DeleteNot really. If you want to run a business in a country, you have to follow the laws of said country.
DeleteThat's kinda it. Pretty simple.
Really? It’s high time countries started to grow a pair against tech companies
Delete"The country will also impose daily fines of $50,000 Brazilian real (~$8,900 USD) to people who try to access X through a virtual private network (VPN)"
ReplyDeleteFrankly, if true this punishment is massively disproportionate to the “crime” (for simplicity let’s go along with the assumption that accessing a shitty social network should be considered a crime) and strongly suggests the governance here isn’t about the best interests of the population.
That said, Musk can take his defense of free speech (only when he agrees with what is being said), his personal attacks on politicians in name free speech (unless they are Russian or Chinese, to please whom he took the position that free speech must only be defended if the law says so, not as an inalienable human right), wrap them over his dysfunctional X and you can imagine the rest. Let’s see if more babies come out.
To be fair, that fine is pretty much unenforceable in the real world. Not sure if the judge is unaware of how the Internet works at all, or he's waving a deterrent.
DeleteBecause it's not for normal people it's for people who know that it's wrong but just want to cause a culture war...
DeleteThe fine is meant for the persons that were ordered banned in X due to hate speech, not for every citizen in Brazil.
DeleteThat's not how I read the translated court order.
DeleteNot true . Read again
Deletequestion is if this happened in America, will it have been ok ?
ReplyDeleteHe’d threaten to leave their astronauts stranded in space.
DeleteExactly. NASA and our federal government hate being beholden to such a spoiled rich kid who loves authoritarians. Too bad Boeing is run by idiot bean counters.
DeleteDifferent countries have different laws. Also, corporate lobbying is legal in US, so he'll just go to Texas's judge.
DeleteIf Elon didn't appoint one legal representative for Twitter in the US and the US ordered it to shut down then yes it would have been fine there too.
DeleteNot sure how Brazilian laws work ( I assume it’s not so different ) but judges don’t typically on whim decide that companies require legal representative in a country . It comes from regulatory bodies.
DeleteTypically , the legislative arm of govt comes up law, companies are given the chance to input or comply before it becomes law . Judges don’t typically make new laws, they only interpret existing ones. This smells more like judicial overreach than anything.
No, they aren't making new laws. Xitter did have offices in Brazil, he purposefully shut down operations there in order to not comply with the first judgment. That's why the judge is now banning.
DeleteLove the "Xitter". I am totally stealing that :-)
DeleteRegardless feels like judicial overreach. I don’t see this happening any lawful democratic country, especially not by a “crusading judge “. . But hey, their country, their rules.
Delete"Regardless feels like judicial overreach."
DeleteIt doesn't matter how it feels like to you personally. Brazil has laws (different from US's), Twitter was not following those laws, and Brazilian supreme judge made a decision based on their laws. What exactly is "crusading" about a judge applying their country's laws? If Twitter don't like local laws, they can always voluntarily leave that market.
"Not sure how Brazilian laws work ( I assume it’s not so different )"
DeleteIt appears they are different, here is a good article about it https://www.pbs.org/newshour/world/how-a-brazilian-supreme-court-judge-could-block-elon-musks-x-from-the-country
Good questions.
DeleteThe fines on people accessing X? No, not ok IMO.
Banning X? Well, to keep with current topics, I’d much rather see X banned than Telegram. The latter is only toxic if you actively are into toxicity and look for it. The former is a megaphone for toxicity.
Banning X could be illegal (unless we change the law, which would be ironic and funny as Musk doesn’t complain about censorship in Russia and China because it’s by the law) and a very very slippery slope, but with the shiny silver lining of clearing the space for a better alternative to swiftly replace it. Everyone moves to Threads or Bluesky (except the crazies who can go to Truth social please) and the world is probably a better place.
Personally, while I won’t go as far as to say X should be banned, I would celebrate its demise. It’s something that’s tolerated at most, not welcome.
I’d celebrate it.
DeleteDidn't they say they're going to respect laws of the countries they operate in?
DeleteIf Twitter doesn't like the judge's order, they can appeal it in Brazilian courts, and argue why it's "illegal".
I don’t know if Musk is lying or otherwise, but according to him, they can’t go to court their lawyer in Brazil was threatened with arrest and her bank account frozen . How can you go to court if the judge makes it impossible to get a lawyer ?
DeleteYes it’s kind of difficult to go to court on your own accord when you are aggressively breaking the law. So maybe if Twitter-X did what they have to according to Brazilian law, there wouldn’t be any threats of arrest…
Deletethis logic makes zero sense. Judicial process is what determines if something is legal or otherwise. Even murderes have their day in court, if you wouldn’t let someone be represented in court, how else will they have their day in court
DeleteYeah you’ll get dragged to court in shackles. I was talking about on your own accord. Like filing a lawsuit against the government.
DeleteCountries are starting to realize that “social networks” might have a thin veneer of wholesome goodness like cat videos and sharing memories with friends. But that’s just a paper mask to cover the underlying tools built by billionaires and corporations to control and/or destabilize society. This judge may or may not be taking too extreme measures, but he’s acting under the law and doing something
ReplyDeleteGreat point. Society needs to do something about the easy way criminals and insurrectionists can organize and recruit on Twitter and Telegram. At least Facebook pretends to moderate, even if Zuckerberg bends over backwards to please the very weird extreme far-right activists and calls them “conservatives” lol.
Delete(Conservatives should be protecting our air and water, our natural resources and the beauty of our open spaces, our ability to grow our own healthy food and graze animals on open uncontaminated grasslands. They should fight climate change, pollution, corporate greed, and the sale of our water to Monsanto and to China.)
I can’t find an article anywhere that objectively states whether or not this judge is exceeding his authority under Brazilian law. Every outlet including this one positions this as a feud between Musk and the judge. If the judge has this legal authority, it’s not a feud at all
ReplyDelete"If the judge has this legal authority"
DeleteYes, he has. I usually don't like to be people's "google assistant", but here you go https://www.pbs.org/newshour/world/how-a-brazilian-supreme-court-judge-could-block-elon-musks-x-from-the-country
The 'feud' angle is exhausting. On one side, there is the Supreme Court of a sovereign country. On the other, an internet troll who refuses to follow the law. Who will win?!
DeleteYes and no. Nothing in politics is ever very simple.
DeleteDoes De Moraes have the authority to do what he did? Yes. Also, he proceeds not always in an orthodox way. The way he subpoenaed Musk is one example. But he is a Justice from the Supreme Court in Brazil and has little, if none, supervision. No one reviews his orders but other Justices. He could be impeached but this would be very hard. The thing is, Musk pissed off almost the whole government, particularly the Judiciary, and they are willing to overlook some of De Moraes missteps.
So, is Musk in the right? Nope. He is violating the Brazilian legislation in a very willing and, dare I say, dramatic way. He is not imposing moderation whatsoever and not complying with orders to take down hate speech, electoral crimes, racism, homophobia, and other crimes. He proceeded this way in a very public and defiant manner. You should know that De Moraes is responsible to judge crimes of the far right in the last 4 years. The far right is very much organized worldwide. So attacking De Moraes will score him points with this very particular branch of the world politics.
It is sort ironic for an American to ask if the judge is doing a good job, our Supreme Court is almost all extreme right-wing activists who make up fake stuff to take the country back to the 1850’s. Appointed by a President who got into of office by Russian propaganda, and two of which were made possible by Mitch McConnell’s obviously fraudulent and morally bankrupt manipulation of the Congressional nomination process.
DeleteHe took the "Brazilian Miku" trend really badly, huh.
ReplyDeleteAlexandre De Voldemort
ReplyDeletegood riddance
ReplyDeletestan twitter and gay twitter are so over
ReplyDeleteFree of Speech!
ReplyDeletesomeday we will all be free.
ReplyDeleteI guess for Brazil X is now Ex
ReplyDeleteBetter off without it.
ReplyDeleteBreaking news: Average Brazilian IQ increases by 20 points
ReplyDeleteBlueSky here I come. So sick of fElon's bullshit
ReplyDeleteBrazil doesn’t screw around with this sort of stuff. I was on a team of consultants that did legal response (responding to subpoenas such) for another big tech company years ago, and they threatened to arrest our in-country team members if we didn’t hand over the information we asked for. At the time, it was our policy to only hand over minimal information in response to non-US requests, but after that we had to rethink our policy.
ReplyDeletewithout all the bloomberg tracking & paywalls
ReplyDeletehttps://www.nytimes.com/2024/08/30/world/americas/brazil-elon-musk-x-blocked.html
It's really weird that the judge in Brazil doesn't feel threatened by Space Karen's memes.
ReplyDeleteA country’s sovereignty should always be bigger than big techs and oligarchs
ReplyDeleteThis is not a good thing and please don't think that it is because Musk is a POS pissbaby.
ReplyDeleteTwitter is known for being the first social media platform through which news became mainstream, through which social and political change was affected. Like it or not, but often social media like twitter is the primary or only source for local news and events.
The government picking and choosing which ones its captives are permitted to access is prior restraint to a massive degree. It is essentially barring the doors of a massive library. More specifically, it is essentially giving the next Bolsanaro, the next Trump, the power to bar the doors of massive libraries that have what they consider to the 'fake news and hate speech'.
DeleteIt is a very good thing to ban platforms that won't comply with subpoenas seeking messages regarding a potential coup attempt from right wingers.
Jfc, do you think they are banning it because they don’t like the news shared on it???
no alan is bad man therefore this is good
DeleteBrazil doing what EU can't, suspend the mElon hate spitting machine
ReplyDeleteElon has yet to refuse any direct EU orders, the big qualms are in the UK, which has to figure that out on its own. But I'd bet there's some new regulations cooking.
DeleteMusk has fuck you money and apparently using it
ReplyDeleteElmo can go fuck himself
ReplyDeleteAnd poof just like that 24 million users gone from X...
ReplyDeleteThey arrested the last rep after X named them. Currupt
ReplyDeleteGood, hopefully more countries and judges follow!
ReplyDeleteMy only complaint about this……..WE WERE ROBBED OF BEST NBA TWITTER FAN ACCOUNT. I SALUTE YOU TIMBERWOLVES BRAZIL.
ReplyDeletePlease do this in Europe too 🙏🏼
ReplyDeleteIt would be great if the rest of the world could follow suit
ReplyDeleteThe power of social media is in volume use/sharing. The use of VPN to circumvent the block probably won’t be high enough for the platform to remain relevant in that country. If properly implemented, the people in that country will just move a different app.
ReplyDeleteI like it. X had always been a trash talk platform.
ReplyDeleteBrazil just got rid of one the most toxic places in the internet. I think this is a win for Brasil.
ReplyDeleteNow do everywhere else.
ReplyDeleteBraaaazzzzzieeeuuu
ReplyDeleteI’ve always hated you mother fuckers for beating our asses en el mundial, but now you have a friend in me.
Viva Brazil!
Me too! Yay authoritarianism!!!
Deleteauthoritarian Is when no Twitter
Delete