This is my personal blog, which is about news in general. we have a collaboration, with Mashable. my blog It's called ''Find a way out of reality'' why?, I ask you that question. find a way to escape reality.
I believe that freedom of expression is a right for all human beings, and that this freedom cannot and should not be suppressed by anyone; and of course, whoever issues an opinion is exclusively personally responsible for the opinion. In many countries this freedom has been either fought or suppressed using lame excuses, and one of these countries is Brazil where the Federal Supreme Court has been behaving like a Court of the Holy Office, especially by one of the ministers, Alexandre de Moraes
I appreciate your response, to which I ask you to realize that HaShen did not place limits on what people can and cannot say; truth that have several warnings about not offending others, not slandering, etc., etc., and also about the value of truth. Also in the Laws of HaShen are the guidelines to hold each person responsible for what they do, say and even state that children do not pay for parents and goes further, also stating that those who see a crime and remain silent are accomplices by omission and equally pay the penalty. that the criminal has to pay. Continuing, I am in favor of the full application of HaShen's Laws in the lives of all human beings, without exception.
Why doesn't anyone find it horrifying that if you speak your mind against the ruling powers, even for free speech and the free exchange of ideas, it will invariably get you arrested with trumped up charges. Of course, I'm talking about countries that used to pride themselves on free speech and expression of thought.
How would Telegram even be able to "moderate" such a system that is end-to-end encrypted? They probably don't even know what users are talking about, much less be able to moderate a bunch of cipher-text.
They are moderated indeed. This encryption stuff is relative.
Besides, I just read," Does Telegram provide end-to-end encryption? Telegram offers end-to-end encryption only when you use its secret chat option. The secret chat enables client-to-client encryption, meaning the receiver uses a cryptographic key pair with its counterpart saved on your device instead of Telegram's server.”.
So telegram is not end to end encryption. Only the secret chat.
It bounces the messages around the globe, making it harder to track them.
Telegram is decentralised, meaning it runs on multiple servers all around the globe, so that it can not be taken offline by tyrants, like the western regimes today. Of course the Western globalist 4thReich hates that, lol.
Thank you; in other words for practical purposes, not. The penalty for discovery of this would be death, or the NK gulag.
So the phrases "...offline by tyrants, like the Western regimes todar." and "...Western globalist 4thReich..." in Aloha Snackbar's post above should have read "...offline by tyrants, like the eastern regimes today." and "...Eastern globalist 4thReich..."
It can equally read eastern or western. The poster chose western and is not wrong to do so. This article is a clear example of a western tyranny.
Any tyranny has penalties for speaking against the regime, but the fact that it’s illegal doesn’t mean it’s impossible, so it’s not the case that for all practical purposes North Koreans can’t use telegram, it’s just more difficult than in countries where the citizens can easily get modern tech. I’m confident that 2 and 3 are easily achievable for residents with connections outside the country (e.g. South Korean relatives who could pay for star-link), but I don’t know the extent of government control over the phone market, and suspect item 1 might require smuggling.
NK is like Stalin in the USSR, except their sun god position is hereditary.
Given that the West is far better than the East why is it only the West that gets the bad press? Start on those who are worse. I have had to say to the odd person, if the West is so bad and the East so wonderful, why don't you go and live there? They never do....
This is like arguing we don’t need to worry about free speech until it’s as bad as the USSR was. At that point it’s too late to do a course correction and you have to start over. Guarding and reforming is easier than revolting and rebuilding.
I accept that we don’t want to suggest France is no better than North Korea, but that doesn’t mean we should stay silent as they head in that direction.
In the recent past I have argued with someone who thought Russia was the best thing since sliced bread and lambasted the West. I tested him on this many times, and eventually he said he didn't move to Russia as his family was here.
An old family friend remembered the hoops on the railway lines out of the USSR so they could shoot those trying to leave the Socialist paradise on the roof. Then there was the Westerner invited to some sort of jamboree in Warsaw I think it was. He was extolling how wonderful the paradise was, before someone suggested to him he go and speak to the people huddled beneath some bridge. He couldn't cope with what he heard from them and got the next train back. Oh, and how people thought Dear Old Uncle Joe was so wonderful in the 1930's.
Every country needs guarding and reforming, but not to say these are the same as the really evil people.
I'm perfectly happy for them to eavesdrop if they go get a warrant and how probable cause. They have to meet a burden of proof in order to eavesdrop just like they would on your phone. I'm not going to restrict law enforcement from doing their job against child traffickers, drug lords and whatever else evil people are doing out there.
I think restricting free speech is a slippery slope. But, there's a long-standing precedent that if law enforcement is able to get a warrant they can tap your phone, get your internet history and build a case. Same should be said for any communication or social media application. It should not be a locked box where crime can be committed and law enforcement cannot have the opportunity to meet the burden of proof to get evidence or do a proper investigation.
That said, it's not in my opinion, the job of the company to moderate what is said. That is free speech. It's no different than people having a phone call or standing in the park talking to a group. It's protected and should always remain protected even if we don't like what is being said. Someday it may be you on the other side being censored.
For long the adverts and contents of printed newspapers were subject to very much the same sorts of rules, including D notices for matters of security.
The debate now is over whether Telegram etc are newspapers or simply, say, a noticeboard in a park with free pens and paper for messages to be put up.
The law seems to be that if, as the supplier of the writing material in the park allows it to be used as a means of communication for, say, a gang interested in trading guns and persuading little girls into bushes to rape them then that supplier is also liable at law- unless those messages are torn down and thrown away.
Genuine matters of debate should not be censored,but the Left is all to keen on doing that to be woke, while doing nothing about Jew hate.
It IS different. Millions of people will read and spread it.
"It should not be a locked box where crime can be committed and law enforcement cannot have the opportunity to meet the burden of proof to get evidence or do a proper investigation" - if this can be guaranteed and will be applied, I could join you. Plus any speech involving incitement should be deleted ASAP. Incitement IS a crime.
Next I’d like to see Zuckerberg arrested for some of the same - allowing terrorist information, hate speech, antisemitism, calls for genocide - and tried on the same basis. Surely there is now a precedent, or do US based facilitators of this activity have no one to answer to as they defile the minds of the world?
Really? What do you call the dead on January 6th who were protesting what they saw as a rigged election? What do you call the political prisoners in the D.C. gulag that have been there for years without ever seeing a pre-trial attorney?
I thought the Capitol Police got it, not so much the rioters- and that is what they were, however much we approve of them desecrating Pelosi's office.
DC gulag sounds a bit rich to me. Are you sure they were denied attorney visits and Court appearances? As for guilt/ innocence, sorry that is down to the juries.
They may have thought the voting was rigged, SCOTUS disagreed, and so did both the House and the Senate. They didn't have the votes. It is complete nonsense to suggest that Pence could have sent the certifications back to the States on his own order. Personally, I think there was some vote rigging, but Trump couldn't prove it and so, in US terms, it didn't happen. He only had 4 years as POTUS to sort that out...
Oh dear. 2000 Mules (once I had got past the footwear items) seems to be a D'Souza conspiracy theorist idea, and on a quick scan I could not find the dungeons.
Zuckerberg probably has colluded with the NSA and is off the hook. He also cancelled his proposed digital currency. One wonders if WhatsApp is really a secure communication channel now that it is in his hands.
Free speech is under a direct assault in one of the Socialist States of Europe. I hope there is at least one decent judge in the French justice system or at the European Court of Human Rights.
What material support has he provided? A private message system available to all doesn’t count any more than making knives to sell to the public makes you responsible for when someone stabs someone with one.
France is a real country. It is defenitely NOT a banana republic. They don't hunt people without evidence. Millionaires in particular have all the money they need to pay some good lawyers. Those lawyers can become a real pain if you start harassing their client without reason. If someone wanted to harm this gentleman, he would not ask the police to detain him. He would put explosives, like the bayesian yacht, to get rid of him. What do you think? I want your honest opinion. Do you really think that a modern yacht which costs millions can sink in a few minutes because of a rain?
Yes it can. The Titanic was also called unsinkable, and it sank. In fact, better not go on a boat proclaimed to be unsinkable. I have had enough of conspiracy theories, even if they are a hobby in the US.
The Titanic let in water, same reason for sinking as the Bayesian. That was because an iceberg puctured below the waterline and let in water greater than the pumps or the watertight bulkheads could cope with. It was a passenger liner. This was a rich man's pleasure boat. The point is, watercraft proclaimed to be unsinkable often, in fact, DO sink.
No doubt an enquiry will detemine why it sank- I guess inter alia the hatches/ portholes were not closed, allowing water in greater than the craft could take without sinking- we will see.
that's the point , it is impossible to let more water in than the crew could take out IF you don't make a hole. If the situation was similar to the scenario you propose, the water would have entered pretty evenly. The boat fell to the right side and they found the passengers in the left, that means it got immediately under sea water and lost boyance at the right side (not just some waves and water from the rain). Someone punched a hole (I suspect with explosives) and the right side got immediately under seawater. If you try to sink it without opening a hole at the bottom you will fail.
exactly! If a country wants to stop you, you are dead. They are not going to beg or to ask for your cooperation. An accident will happen. You must have not read my scond post. What do you think about the ultra modern and super expensive "bayesian" yacht (the unsinkable) which sank outside of palermo/sicily. A millionaire owned that ship and they say it is an accident. What do you think about that?
Initially I wondered If it had been sabotage or deliberate in some way, particularly as an associate of Lynch had died in a car accident a few days before, but unless evidence comes to light I will conclude that it was a tragic accident. While some in HP will be unhappy that the jury found him innocent the whole affair must have been a nightmare for all concerned. I hope that Britain cancels the extradition treaty with the USA as a result - it is unpopular in the UK, but Britain is very much a vassal state of the USA and I will not be holding my breath.
Edit: the Italians are aware from past experience that the US government does what it likes and I believe if any evidence comes to light they will publicise it.
If you believe that Russia's invasion of Ukraine was unprovoked then you should read 'Nyet means Nyet' which is easy to find on the internet. The author is the current director of the CIA...
I have looked at this. The first part of 1C of the Ambassador's cable is present, but not the rest. May you guide me to the complete cable to put it into context?
It says, "strong opposition" and "potential military theat" by Lavrov. It also says, "an emotional and neuralgic" {end of excerpt from cable}.
What I have to say about this for now is this is by no means a sufficient indicator that war would result. The emotional and neuralgic item can be dismissed; whoever conducted diplomacy based on the Czar's temper tantrums?
War came, but only because the Czar wanted to restore the Russian Imperial domains/ USSR "republics" (probably conflated and confused in his mind).
When I search, I'm taken to a page 08MOSCOW265_a with an extension that is short for hypertext mark up language. The document appears complete to me and contains 12 sections in all. The url belongs to wikileaks and the path to the file is plusd then cables then the filename (above with extension). There are forward slashes separating the portions of the url
There is also a helpful document which you can find by searching for:
There is no privacy or security on that website. They allow advertisements of bogus goods and there's no way to tell if you're speaking to a real person or an identity thief with the same name.
Tucker is right, darkness descending on a former free world. Western Europe is now paying the price for the utopian free world, by letting millions of muslims to hijack their “free world”. Regardless, Durov will be out by the end of this week.
Tucker is the same guy who let Putin spout revisionist history on his program in an effort to justify genocide and mass war crimes, all while Putin eliminates critics in his tyrannical dystopia. I did, however, chuckle as Tucker’s trip to a Russian grocery store revealed his discovery that Americans are rich.
Blogs like this are as close as I get to social media, so I've no idea if he made the world worse or better for his personal gain. But if it's worse, lock him up. If better, give him a medal. Let the truth be told.
This whole debate is pretty much the conduct between freedom/privacy Vs security/safety.
Whether it is right or wrong, I'm not sure. Privacy is important of course, but how many bad actors are we protecting behind the idea of privacy?
There is no easy answer. If you're advocating for full privacy, then you need to accept that there will always be avenues where illegal activity can occur. If you're focused more on safety, then the risk of abuse from the state and other actors is always there.
The reality of the matter is, we need to balance the two, and that will be an ongoing struggle to balance as new things come up. Both companies, states and the public need to be aware of this.
"I'm personally for the privacy side," Durov said in that interview when asked whether privacy concerns outweighed security risks. "But one thing that should be clear is that you cannot make just one exception for law enforcement without endangering private communications of hundreds of millions of people because encryption is either secure or not."
Wait isn't it the good guy? He made VKontakte, a better social website than Facebook, but Russian government took the project from him because he declined the request to give private user details to the govt.
He also did not want to block Aleksey Navalny's profile.
I've read about him years ago and he's on the side of good, a clever good Russian
Ok his software cares about privacy and is used by ppl doing illegal stuff too. So - should we arrest the knives manufacturer after someone stabs someone with a knife?
Went to read Russian forums: some conspiracy theory that Durov met Putin, and that Telegram shares info related to Ukraine, and Western secret services decided not to tolerate this... but then a question is why would he 'stop' in France knowing that this can happen
The tech billionaire overlords are generally in a struggle with the authorities. They want complete anonymity and protection for their customers and the authorities want back doors into people’s online information. The tech overlooks went deregulation and the authorities want more regulation. Customers instinctively want both privacy and protection. These are contradictions because protection comes via regulations and therefore more government involvement whereas privacy comes from less government involvement unless of the tech overlords themselves choose to access private data for profit for example to train AI. These conundrums are not going to be resolved anytime soon.
You better get the fuck out, just in case. Move your coins to a non-custodian wallet at least where you have full control, in case Telegram is eventually blocked in EU.
Quite a sad event for the state of privacy in Europe. I'm not a big fan of Durov and his policy of tolerating absolutely abhorrent people on his platform, but this can set a pretty bad precedent.
Returning from Azerbaijan, where Durov most likely had a secret meeting with Putin, Durov was arrested in France. Kremlin is furious. Anything else you need to know?
In fact, a couple of years ago there was a ton of channels with movies and pirated tv series and stuff but nowadays those channels get closed REALLY FAST to the point I barely use it
Ive got no clue what the french are talking about, sounds like he was arrested for being russian, basically
Telegram is not using encryption unless you create a private chat that lacks most of the services features, so barely anyone uses it, and channels are not encrypted at all. But it’s worse than that, they store all messages in clear text in their cloud. Nobody knows where the company behind telegram actually resides, what their business model is, where their servers are located and who owns the company other that the arrested guy. Super shady company and given that they store all your messages in clear text, a change of ownership means whoever controls the company then, can see everything ever sent though the service.
No, it means that Telegram is not cooperating with law enforcement officially. This shows nothing about the general security of the platform. Especially considering how TG's E2EE is very limited (https://blog.cryptographyengineering.com/2024/08/25/telegram-is-not-really-an-encrypted-messaging-app/).
If you want privacy, Signal is certainly a better choice.
Russia being mad about this on the other hand shows that TG is likely an asset for them.
The few places where it is that, they use subpar encryption riddled with bugs and backdoors. The reason for the arrest is unwillingness to allow western intelligence onboard as opposed to eg. Facebook and lack of self-censorship.
This guy is arrested basically cause Governments around the world want access to Telegram data. This dude flee Russia when Putin asked for access to such data.
For kids who don’t understand - Durov was on his back flight from Azerbaijan, where he met with Putin. Western lobby has a lot to discuss with him after that.
In addition to words, there is evidence, at least a photo where they are side by side or at the same event?
Obviously not. But, if France did this, where “democracy” and “freedom of speech” reign, then, of course, they are right. And now we are creating the same situation when Pavel Durov was detained in Russia. This would be funny for a country with a dictatorship and control over the media.)
Durov visits Azerbaijan and coincidentally finds himself there at the same time with Putin. Gotta love these naive takes, especially considering that Durov almost never leaves UAE and did not visit Baku for past 15 years. You kids need to also understand that there is a pile of reasons why Telegram is the only foreign social-media platform that is not banned in Russia.
"Telegram is the only foreign social-media platform that is not banned in Russia"
You are misinformed, almost no social-media platform is banned in Russia, e.g. WhatsApp, Facebook, TikTok, Youtube, Instagram, etc. are all available. I would struggle to find a single one that was banned.
Kid are you delusional or what? I’m russian myself, Facebook and Instagram are officially banned and not reachable without VPN. Meta is officially considered as extremist and terrorist company. Watsapp is the only product still available because it’s simple messenger and not social-media platform. TikTok is Chinese product which is heavily censored in Russia also thanks to friends from CCP. Even huge pile of VPN services are banned in Russia. Youtube is slowed to death speed cap of 94 kb/s and not usable also. They are actively discussing in Roskomnadzor and TVs now taking down Google fully with all of its products.
Finally! His BG and Telegram should be banned here in the West; no need of further russian propaganda and kremlin mouthpieces. Hosting russianeonazi such the rusich group and wagnerites is disgusting.
This makes me think the EU is batshit authoritarian over their so-called "free speech" that is nothing more than a hoax. This is not the actions of democratic nations, but of autocracies. This is contradicting the concept of freedom itself, and the ones cheering stuff like this are partially to blame and are part of the problem.
Draconian tactics for sure, they basically want to spy on everyone 24/7 which basically just drive criminal activities further underground, You shouldn't make the CEO responsible for how people chose to use their product. By that logic If A new Gun manufacturer's gun is used in a Schools shooting, the CEO is responsible and should be arrested for mass-murder. There will always be criminals, and spying on everyone will just create more criminals.
Most comments complain about the French... but it's being glossed over that Pavlov took this conscious decision, it has been done willingly. He must be trying to do something I cannot see through, like sparing his life from Russia or likewise
Mistake landing? But could be wild if he want out of russia and this is the way he do it, but would he not have made a deal with cia/FBI first to be protected?
Wait, is this democracy and freedom of speech?) It’s especially funny that he was convicted under the same articles under which he was persecuted in Russia; as we see, France did not go far.)
Why not just have a bit of moderation though? How is sharing CP & drugs justified at all? Is that what we are unintentionally promoting when we say "free media"? I'm not supporting the arrest, but just curious to know.
Telegram has created a very large non believer group in the Netherlands who are shouting to kill all european leaders, who and wef.
Telegram does nothing to stop the misinformation on it's platform. It's 99% fake shit by bots and users fall into a Russian trap to destabilize the West.
But yeah show your support for an owner who openly lets the taliban, russia, IS, and many other terrorist organization use his platform to reach into the mind of your children!
It baffles me how people don't understand the limits of freedom. Selling drugs, and covering a bunch of other illegal stuff and not cooperating with the governments on that matter
This is a terrible miscarriage of justice. The Putin regime will one day pay for this suppression of freedom of spee.. oh sorry, he was arrested by French authorities? My bad.
I meant to say this criminal deserves to be arrested for enabling abuse of CHILDREN! Won't you think of the children?! I'm glad somebody is finally doing something about this deranged psychopath.
Holy shit. This app is a home to terrorist organisations and various rings, but also enables communication for basically all of Ukraine and lots of countries. It's a shame, shame, shame to try to arrest the CEO who is NOT welcome in Russia too. Even if the app has shady things like crypto or doesn't resonate well with copyright laws its substantial to resistance around the world.
The fascist authotarians are already in power in Europe and have been for a long time, of course, they call themselves anti-fascists and they justify their repression and control as a mean to protect democracy and safety but it is just a facade.
Usually the circlejerk of the sub is fully supportive of authoritarians from the EU because they cannot admit that the people and policies they supported were the real dangers, they thought the bad guys were "the others" while it was them.
Glad to see someone slowly realising their mistakes, sadly, it's too late, if you want freedoms you should run away from this continent, it's only gonna get worse.
If he was using the platform to help support illegal activities and advocate for those activities going on - cough cough like Musk does with bigotry and hate groups on his platform - then yes charge him. But Telegram is pretty anti-illegal shit. It happens a lot sure, but I see a lot of that shit shot down FAST on channels I'm on that are for other subjects but you have someone trying to sell shit out of nowhere.
Telegram while not fully E2E, is a VERY popular source of more protected/safe messaging and data sharing. The absolute antithesis to what powerful governments want. Governments hate privacy and freedoms.
Also please don't compare to the pirate bay. I like places like that, but providing a host to illegal content in countries where it's illegal and not working to take down such data is and should be illegal lol. I support sailing the high seas but let's not act like it ain't illegal. That's DIFFERENT, than places that support legal sharing of data, or rom hacks that don't provide the roms, or video game system emulators for example. None of that is illegal, or just as illegal as duping a sauce and selling it like Walmart does lol. Which shouldn't be.
Keep in mind that Vodafone and the likes are also mandated by law to provide information about their subscribers and they provide that info to law enforcement when asked. Telegram didn't.
Now he has come to understand that the world is governed by a group of individuals
ReplyDeleteEncryption keys serve as a powerful tool in the pursuit of freedom
I think we should arrest French goverment to investigate criminal activity in the Parliament.
ReplyDeleteThe One Narrative Initiative™ police are active.
ReplyDeleteI wonder which political party is closer to this in the US . I will vote for the opposite of that one
ReplyDeleteUnderstandable - now don't be picky and arrest Elon Musk as well.
ReplyDeleteNice
ReplyDeleteNo, not nice
DeleteIt was two days ago
ReplyDeletebut it is still relevant, this has to be said, showed, exposed!
DeleteWe are at war for freedom of expression, the next one could be rumble, x and so on
ReplyDelete💯
DeleteI believe that freedom of expression is a right for all human beings, and that this freedom cannot and should not be suppressed by anyone; and of course, whoever issues an opinion is exclusively personally responsible for the opinion. In many countries this freedom has been either fought or suppressed using lame excuses, and one of these countries is Brazil where the Federal Supreme Court has been behaving like a Court of the Holy Office, especially by one of the ministers, Alexandre de Moraes
ReplyDeleteThe laws in France and Germany were meant to shut the Shoah denial speeches up.
DeleteFreedom of speech isn’t a thing when you are breaking the law such as terrorism or pedofiles in Pavel Durov’s case
DeleteI appreciate your response, to which I ask you to realize that HaShen did not place limits on what people can and cannot say; truth that have several warnings about not offending others, not slandering, etc., etc., and also about the value of truth. Also in the Laws of HaShen are the guidelines to hold each person responsible for what they do, say and even state that children do not pay for parents and goes further, also stating that those who see a crime and remain silent are accomplices by omission and equally pay the penalty. that the criminal has to pay. Continuing, I am in favor of the full application of HaShen's Laws in the lives of all human beings, without exception.
DeleteWhy doesn't anyone find it horrifying that if you speak your mind against the ruling powers, even for free speech and the free exchange of ideas, it will invariably get you arrested with trumped up charges. Of course, I'm talking about countries that used to pride themselves on free speech and expression of thought.
ReplyDeleteLike Russia, Belarus, Syria; yes it is sad
DeleteNow also UK, Canada, Audtralia, Ireland where pdofiles walk free and people hurting other peoples egos online gets jailtime!
DeleteHow would Telegram even be able to "moderate" such a system that is end-to-end encrypted? They probably don't even know what users are talking about, much less be able to moderate a bunch of cipher-text.
ReplyDeleteThey are moderated indeed. This encryption stuff is relative.
DeleteBesides, I just read," Does Telegram provide end-to-end encryption? Telegram offers end-to-end encryption only when you use its secret chat option. The secret chat enables client-to-client encryption, meaning the receiver uses a cryptographic key pair with its counterpart saved on your device instead of Telegram's server.”.
So telegram is not end to end encryption. Only the secret chat.
Even that stores meta data, time and location and who you spoke with.
DeleteTelegram is not encrypted.
DeleteIt bounces the messages around the globe, making it harder to track them.
Telegram is decentralised, meaning it runs on multiple servers all around the globe, so that it can not be taken offline by tyrants, like the western regimes today. Of course the Western globalist 4thReich hates that, lol.
So North Korean people can use it?
DeleteIf they can:
Delete1) Get a cellphone not interfered with by DPRK agents
2) Get an internet connection that doesn’t pass through DPRK filters
3) Not pay for it by a method the DPRK can monitor
Then yes.
Thank you; in other words for practical purposes, not. The penalty for discovery of this would be death, or the NK gulag.
DeleteSo the phrases "...offline by tyrants, like the Western regimes todar." and "...Western globalist 4thReich..." in Aloha Snackbar's post above should have read "...offline by tyrants, like the eastern regimes today." and "...Eastern globalist 4thReich..."
It can equally read eastern or western. The poster chose western and is not wrong to do so. This article is a clear example of a western tyranny.
DeleteAny tyranny has penalties for speaking against the regime, but the fact that it’s illegal doesn’t mean it’s impossible, so it’s not the case that for all practical purposes North Koreans can’t use telegram, it’s just more difficult than in countries where the citizens can easily get modern tech. I’m confident that 2 and 3 are easily achievable for residents with connections outside the country (e.g. South Korean relatives who could pay for star-link), but I don’t know the extent of government control over the phone market, and suspect item 1 might require smuggling.
NK is like Stalin in the USSR, except their sun god position is hereditary.
DeleteGiven that the West is far better than the East why is it only the West that gets the bad press? Start on those who are worse. I have had to say to the odd person, if the West is so bad and the East so wonderful, why don't you go and live there? They never do....
This is like arguing we don’t need to worry about free speech until it’s as bad as the USSR was. At that point it’s too late to do a course correction and you have to start over. Guarding and reforming is easier than revolting and rebuilding.
DeleteI accept that we don’t want to suggest France is no better than North Korea, but that doesn’t mean we should stay silent as they head in that direction.
Agreed. But let it be phrased like that.
DeleteIn the recent past I have argued with someone who thought Russia was the best thing since sliced bread and lambasted the West. I tested him on this many times, and eventually he said he didn't move to Russia as his family was here.
An old family friend remembered the hoops on the railway lines out of the USSR so they could shoot those trying to leave the Socialist paradise on the roof. Then there was the Westerner invited to some sort of jamboree in Warsaw I think it was. He was extolling how wonderful the paradise was, before someone suggested to him he go and speak to the people huddled beneath some bridge. He couldn't cope with what he heard from them and got the next train back. Oh, and how people thought Dear Old Uncle Joe was so wonderful in the 1930's.
Every country needs guarding and reforming, but not to say these are the same as the really evil people.
They got reports.
DeleteWorse for him than refusing to be a censor, he refused to let any Government including the U.S. to build a back-door to eves drop on members.
ReplyDeleteI'm perfectly happy for them to eavesdrop if they go get a warrant and how probable cause. They have to meet a burden of proof in order to eavesdrop just like they would on your phone. I'm not going to restrict law enforcement from doing their job against child traffickers, drug lords and whatever else evil people are doing out there.
DeleteI think restricting free speech is a slippery slope. But, there's a long-standing precedent that if law enforcement is able to get a warrant they can tap your phone, get your internet history and build a case. Same should be said for any communication or social media application. It should not be a locked box where crime can be committed and law enforcement cannot have the opportunity to meet the burden of proof to get evidence or do a proper investigation.
ReplyDeleteThat said, it's not in my opinion, the job of the company to moderate what is said. That is free speech. It's no different than people having a phone call or standing in the park talking to a group. It's protected and should always remain protected even if we don't like what is being said. Someday it may be you on the other side being censored.
Are you talking about the FISA Courts and the general warrants they authorise?
DeleteI’m talking more generally about search warrants. The case is in France after all…
DeleteFor long the adverts and contents of printed newspapers were subject to very much the same sorts of rules, including D notices for matters of security.
DeleteThe debate now is over whether Telegram etc are newspapers or simply, say, a noticeboard in a park with free pens and paper for messages to be put up.
The law seems to be that if, as the supplier of the writing material in the park allows it to be used as a means of communication for, say, a gang interested in trading guns and persuading little girls into bushes to rape them then that supplier is also liable at law- unless those messages are torn down and thrown away.
Genuine matters of debate should not be censored,but the Left is all to keen on doing that to be woke, while doing nothing about Jew hate.
It IS different. Millions of people will read and spread it.
Delete"It should not be a locked box where crime can be committed and law enforcement cannot have the opportunity to meet the burden of proof to get evidence or do a proper investigation" - if this can be guaranteed and will be applied, I could join you. Plus any speech involving incitement should be deleted ASAP. Incitement IS a crime.
Hopefully a fair trial as anyone should expect.
ReplyDeleteNext I’d like to see Zuckerberg arrested for some of the same - allowing terrorist information, hate speech, antisemitism, calls for genocide - and tried on the same basis. Surely there is now a precedent, or do US based facilitators of this activity have no one to answer to as they defile the minds of the world?
Well, at least they do not end up dead like in Putin Russia.
DeleteReally? What do you call the dead on January 6th who were protesting what they saw as a rigged election? What do you call the political prisoners in the D.C. gulag that have been there for years without ever seeing a pre-trial attorney?
DeleteI thought the Capitol Police got it, not so much the rioters- and that is what they were, however much we approve of them desecrating Pelosi's office.
DeleteDC gulag sounds a bit rich to me. Are you sure they were denied attorney visits and Court appearances? As for guilt/ innocence, sorry that is down to the juries.
They may have thought the voting was rigged, SCOTUS disagreed, and so did both the House and the Senate. They didn't have the votes. It is complete nonsense to suggest that Pence could have sent the certifications back to the States on his own order. Personally, I think there was some vote rigging, but Trump couldn't prove it and so, in US terms, it didn't happen. He only had 4 years as POTUS to sort that out...
It's not "rich" if you're in one of these dungeons. You have a lot to learn about this country.
DeleteSee 2000 Mules
Oh dear. 2000 Mules (once I had got past the footwear items) seems to be a D'Souza conspiracy theorist idea, and on a quick scan I could not find the dungeons.
DeleteGive me some real evidence, please.
I am willing to be corrected. I think you live in the US? Court transcripts?
DeleteI will look at 2000 Mules
Zuckerberg probably has colluded with the NSA and is off the hook. He also cancelled his proposed digital currency. One wonders if WhatsApp is really a secure communication channel now that it is in his hands.
DeleteI’m all for capitalism but too much power and money in the hands of too few seems to be one of the worlds major challenges.
DeleteFree speech is under a direct assault in one of the Socialist States of Europe. I hope there is at least one decent judge in the French justice system or at the European Court of Human Rights.
ReplyDeleteIt ain't just Europe.
DeleteTurns out "Providing Material support to terrorists" and dealing narcotics doesn't seem to fall under free speech rules.. who knew?
ReplyDeleteWhat material support has he provided? A private message system available to all doesn’t count any more than making knives to sell to the public makes you responsible for when someone stabs someone with one.
DeleteI will make sure to follow the court proceedings to find out.
DeleteThe law is otherwise in certain countries, if you sell knives to under 18s.
DeleteLearn the difference between "socialism" and "social democracy" and come back later..
DeleteRussia sentences people to 10 years in prison for donating nominal sums to Ukraine humanitarian aid. This sounds a lot worse.
ReplyDeleteWhat is wrong with free press
DeleteI don’t know any details of this case, but what’s bad for Tucker, is good for me.
ReplyDeleteUntil they come for you
DeleteI think he is wrong here, even if usually right. We await the trial.
DeleteI was wondering why Hamas is allowed to have an account there-- this explains it.
ReplyDeleteFrance is a real country. It is defenitely NOT a banana republic. They don't hunt people without evidence. Millionaires in particular have all the money they need to pay some good lawyers. Those lawyers can become a real pain if you start harassing their client without reason. If someone wanted to harm this gentleman, he would not ask the police to detain him. He would put explosives, like the bayesian yacht, to get rid of him. What do you think? I want your honest opinion. Do you really think that a modern yacht which costs millions can sink in a few minutes because of a rain?
ReplyDeleteYes it can. The Titanic was also called unsinkable, and it sank. In fact, better not go on a boat proclaimed to be unsinkable. I have had enough of conspiracy theories, even if they are a hobby in the US.
Deletethe titanic crushed , this was on vacation
DeleteThe Titanic let in water, same reason for sinking as the Bayesian. That was because an iceberg puctured below the waterline and let in water greater than the pumps or the watertight bulkheads could cope with. It was a passenger liner. This was a rich man's pleasure boat. The point is, watercraft proclaimed to be unsinkable often, in fact, DO sink.
DeleteNo doubt an enquiry will detemine why it sank- I guess inter alia the hatches/ portholes were not closed, allowing water in greater than the craft could take without sinking- we will see.
that's the point , it is impossible to let more water in than the crew could take out IF you don't make a hole. If the situation was similar to the scenario you propose, the water would have entered pretty evenly. The boat fell to the right side and they found the passengers in the left, that means it got immediately under sea water and lost boyance at the right side (not just some waves and water from the rain). Someone punched a hole (I suspect with explosives) and the right side got immediately under seawater. If you try to sink it without opening a hole at the bottom you will fail.
DeleteFrance blew up the Greenpeace Rainbow Warrior killing someone on the ship.
Deleteexactly! If a country wants to stop you, you are dead. They are not going to beg or to ask for your cooperation. An accident will happen. You must have not read my scond post. What do you think about the ultra modern and super expensive "bayesian" yacht (the unsinkable) which sank outside of palermo/sicily. A millionaire owned that ship and they say it is an accident. What do you think about that?
DeleteI also wish that I had spent more time studying Bayes theorem at University.
DeleteInitially I wondered If it had been sabotage or deliberate in some way, particularly as an associate of Lynch had died in a car accident a few days before, but unless evidence comes to light I will conclude that it was a tragic accident. While some in HP will be unhappy that the jury found him innocent the whole affair must have been a nightmare for all concerned. I hope that Britain cancels the extradition treaty with the USA as a result - it is unpopular in the UK, but Britain is very much a vassal state of the USA and I will not be holding my breath.
DeleteEdit: the Italians are aware from past experience that the US government does what it likes and I believe if any evidence comes to light they will publicise it.
That was proved. I might sympathise with the French here, but not with the death.
DeleteIf you believe that Russia's invasion of Ukraine was unprovoked then you should read 'Nyet means Nyet' which is easy to find on the internet. The author is the current director of the CIA...
DeleteI have looked at this. The first part of 1C of the Ambassador's cable is present, but not the rest. May you guide me to the complete cable to put it into context?
DeleteIt says, "strong opposition" and "potential military theat" by Lavrov. It also says, "an emotional and neuralgic" {end of excerpt from cable}.
What I have to say about this for now is this is by no means a sufficient indicator that war would result. The emotional and neuralgic item can be dismissed; whoever conducted diplomacy based on the Czar's temper tantrums?
War came, but only because the Czar wanted to restore the Russian Imperial domains/ USSR "republics" (probably conflated and confused in his mind).
When I search, I'm taken to a page 08MOSCOW265_a with an extension that is short for hypertext mark up language. The document appears complete to me and contains 12 sections in all. The url belongs to wikileaks and the path to the file is plusd then cables then the filename (above with extension). There are forward slashes separating the portions of the url
DeleteThere is also a helpful document which you can find by searching for:
salon putin burns
it is an article from the magazine Salon.
See also my reply to this thread
There are also documents whose filenames are 08MOSCOW2653_a,
Delete08MOSCOW2655_a and 08MOSCOW2656_a.
The last is about swine fever, but the first 2 are about other regions nearby including Moldova.
I've not noticed these before and I have yet to study them
There is no privacy or security on that website. They allow advertisements of bogus goods and there's no way to tell if you're speaking to a real person or an identity thief with the same name.
ReplyDeleteJust do not read or post there. That is the ANSWER!
DeleteYou know that people believe what they want to believe; and that masses of wrong and fake informations are posted for them. NO ANSWER.
DeleteP.S. I am not a client of those social networks, Mr. Stoic Pax Romana.
Tucker is right, darkness descending on a former free world. Western Europe is now paying the price for the utopian free world, by letting millions of muslims to hijack their “free world”. Regardless, Durov will be out by the end of this week.
ReplyDeleteTucker is the same guy who let Putin spout revisionist history on his program in an effort to justify genocide and mass war crimes, all while Putin eliminates critics in his tyrannical dystopia. I did, however, chuckle as Tucker’s trip to a Russian grocery store revealed his discovery that Americans are rich.
DeleteFrance is a peculiar country, but I wouldn't bet on that. They don't have no cash bail laws like in the US.
DeleteRussia wants him free. He operated out of Dubai. My mind is made up, let him go to trial.
ReplyDeleteRussia wants him free. That should give you enough clue!
DeleteIt did indeed.
DeleteBlogs like this are as close as I get to social media, so I've no idea if he made the world worse or better for his personal gain. But if it's worse, lock him up. If better, give him a medal. Let the truth be told.
ReplyDeleteThis whole debate is pretty much the conduct between freedom/privacy Vs security/safety.
ReplyDeleteWhether it is right or wrong, I'm not sure. Privacy is important of course, but how many bad actors are we protecting behind the idea of privacy?
There is no easy answer. If you're advocating for full privacy, then you need to accept that there will always be avenues where illegal activity can occur. If you're focused more on safety, then the risk of abuse from the state and other actors is always there.
The reality of the matter is, we need to balance the two, and that will be an ongoing struggle to balance as new things come up. Both companies, states and the public need to be aware of this.
"I'm personally for the privacy side," Durov said in that interview when asked whether privacy concerns outweighed security risks. "But one thing that should be clear is that you cannot make just one exception for law enforcement without endangering private communications of hundreds of millions of people because encryption is either secure or not."
ReplyDeleteI guess France actually was Russia behind the charade 🫣
ReplyDeleteArrest the founder who facilitates privacy and free speech, not the actual criminals using the app. Brilliant.
ReplyDeleteSince when France became one of China's provinces? Smh
ReplyDeleteIf French people aren't gonna stand against this shit, I'm going to believe that France is as bad a place as China and North Korea.
So when Apple doesn’t turn over your iPhone to Law enforcement in France, does Tim Cook go to jail ?
ReplyDelete🇫🇷🟰💩
ReplyDeleteI want Telegram and its CEO to go fuck themselves, but I understand that this is the gateway for them to do the same to Rumble, X and other platforms.
ReplyDeleteWe are at war for Freedom of Speech
so his crime is not spying on users. arrest whoever gave the order and let him rot forever
ReplyDeleteWait isn't it the good guy? He made VKontakte, a better social website than Facebook, but Russian government took the project from him because he declined the request to give private user details to the govt.
ReplyDeleteHe also did not want to block Aleksey Navalny's profile.
I've read about him years ago and he's on the side of good, a clever good Russian
Ok his software cares about privacy and is used by ppl doing illegal stuff too. So - should we arrest the knives manufacturer after someone stabs someone with a knife?
The issue is telegram being uncooperative with law enforcement on the illegal stuff
DeleteIsn't this basically Julian Assange 2.0?
ReplyDeleteKim Dotcom is finally being extradited to the USA. Same kind of facilitating crime in his case
Deletewhat???? that makes no sense
DeleteEveryone knows the good CEOs come only out of USA and Western Europe
ReplyDeleteTelegram is one of the last free medias available in Russia without hurdles so it wouldn't be great to lose it over few criminals on it.
ReplyDeleteWent to read Russian forums: some conspiracy theory that Durov met Putin, and that Telegram shares info related to Ukraine, and Western secret services decided not to tolerate this... but then a question is why would he 'stop' in France knowing that this can happen
ReplyDeletewtf
ReplyDeleteBecause privacy doesn't mean absolute freedom to do what you want. A society should have rules that benefit most people and ensure their safety.
ReplyDeleteabsolutely dystopian
ReplyDeleteBig if true
ReplyDeleteTF1 is the biggest European media.
DeleteNever heard of them
DeleteNot so big if not true
DeleteThe tech billionaire overlords are generally in a struggle with the authorities. They want complete anonymity and protection for their customers and the authorities want back doors into people’s online information. The tech overlooks went deregulation and the authorities want more regulation. Customers instinctively want both privacy and protection. These are contradictions because protection comes via regulations and therefore more government involvement whereas privacy comes from less government involvement unless of the tech overlords themselves choose to access private data for profit for example to train AI. These conundrums are not going to be resolved anytime soon.
ReplyDeletePeople have the right to talk privately.
ReplyDeleteFor all the people defending this should all real life conversations be recored for muh saftey too?
We don't need allegory's to describe how fucked up this is.
ReplyDeleteIt's fucked up.
That's all there is to it.
Interesting. Very interesting.
ReplyDeleteShouldn't we like, arrest elon musk first?
ReplyDeleteMaybe they’ve already planned to… when’s the last time Musk was in France?
Deletethat's fukin wrong :/
ReplyDeleteIt's a hair system, lol. It won't fall off.
ReplyDeleteYou guys really decided to just go hard on authoritarianism, eh?
ReplyDeleteShit my ton wallet 😭
ReplyDeleteYou better get the fuck out, just in case. Move your coins to a non-custodian wallet at least where you have full control, in case Telegram is eventually blocked in EU.
DeleteYeah I did that, this case is bullshit
DeleteQuite a sad event for the state of privacy in Europe. I'm not a big fan of Durov and his policy of tolerating absolutely abhorrent people on his platform, but this can set a pretty bad precedent.
ReplyDeleteHopefully this will fuck up Russian military chain of command haha
ReplyDeleteExtremely important to note this is mostly about open telegram channels. Telegram knows criminal stuff goes on in them but does nothing about it.
ReplyDeleteImagine if facebook had a bunch of "coordinate crimes here" groups. Of course they would be responsible for that.
Of course this thread is filled with the usual propagandists who are trying to sow discord and discontent and make people confused.
Returning from Azerbaijan, where Durov most likely had a secret meeting with Putin, Durov was arrested in France. Kremlin is furious. Anything else you need to know?
ReplyDeleteFinally he will be forced to give the wall back
ReplyDelete"Дуров верни стену", которое зашло слишком далеко
Delete⚡Правительство Франции анонсировало обмен Дурова на стену.
DeleteGet zuckerberg next. Facebook brings criminals together.
ReplyDeleteGuess he makes government an acceptable amount of money and is involved in internal politics.
DeleteWell...does this imply that whatsapp has not E2E encryption whatsoever?
ReplyDeleteRidiculously stupid
ReplyDelete"encrypted"
ReplyDeleteNot a fan of the direction EU has been taking these last few years
ReplyDeleteNo amount of Apple charger disputes makes up for the all the other stuff, sorry.
Ive never seen anything weird on telegram
ReplyDeleteIn fact, a couple of years ago there was a ton of channels with movies and pirated tv series and stuff but nowadays those channels get closed REALLY FAST to the point I barely use it
Ive got no clue what the french are talking about, sounds like he was arrested for being russian, basically
Fuck off, freedom of speech is paramount, this is governments not wanting citizens to communicate without their rule, fuck France
ReplyDeleteTelegram is not using encryption unless you create a private chat that lacks most of the services features, so barely anyone uses it, and channels are not encrypted at all. But it’s worse than that, they store all messages in clear text in their cloud. Nobody knows where the company behind telegram actually resides, what their business model is, where their servers are located and who owns the company other that the arrested guy. Super shady company and given that they store all your messages in clear text, a change of ownership means whoever controls the company then, can see everything ever sent though the service.
ReplyDeleteThat means telegram is awesome and governments are unable to backdoor it.
ReplyDeleteSad day for privacy though
DeleteNo, it means that Telegram is not cooperating with law enforcement officially. This shows nothing about the general security of the platform. Especially considering how TG's E2EE is very limited (https://blog.cryptographyengineering.com/2024/08/25/telegram-is-not-really-an-encrypted-messaging-app/).
If you want privacy, Signal is certainly a better choice.
Russia being mad about this on the other hand shows that TG is likely an asset for them.
Telegram groups are a cesspool of illegal and criminal behavior. Also, telegram is a privacy nightmare.
ReplyDeleteNo one smart is using telegram anyways. Signal or sessions is way better if you actually care about privacy and security.
ReplyDelete"encrypted"
ReplyDelete/s
The few places where it is that, they use subpar encryption riddled with bugs and backdoors. The reason for the arrest is unwillingness to allow western intelligence onboard as opposed to eg. Facebook and lack of self-censorship.
This guy is arrested basically cause Governments around the world want access to Telegram data. This dude flee Russia when Putin asked for access to such data.
ReplyDeleteFor kids who don’t understand - Durov was on his back flight from Azerbaijan, where he met with Putin. Western lobby has a lot to discuss with him after that.
ReplyDeleteIn addition to words, there is evidence, at least a photo where they are side by side or at the same event?
DeleteObviously not. But, if France did this, where “democracy” and “freedom of speech” reign, then, of course, they are right. And now we are creating the same situation when Pavel Durov was detained in Russia. This would be funny for a country with a dictatorship and control over the media.)
Durov visits Azerbaijan and coincidentally finds himself there at the same time with Putin. Gotta love these naive takes, especially considering that Durov almost never leaves UAE and did not visit Baku for past 15 years. You kids need to also understand that there is a pile of reasons why Telegram is the only foreign social-media platform that is not banned in Russia.
Delete"Telegram is the only foreign social-media platform that is not banned in Russia"
DeleteYou are misinformed, almost no social-media platform is banned in Russia, e.g. WhatsApp, Facebook, TikTok, Youtube, Instagram, etc. are all available. I would struggle to find a single one that was banned.
Kid are you delusional or what? I’m russian myself, Facebook and Instagram are officially banned and not reachable without VPN. Meta is officially considered as extremist and terrorist company. Watsapp is the only product still available because it’s simple messenger and not social-media platform. TikTok is Chinese product which is heavily censored in Russia also thanks to friends from CCP. Even huge pile of VPN services are banned in Russia. Youtube is slowed to death speed cap of 94 kb/s and not usable also. They are actively discussing in Roskomnadzor and TVs now taking down Google fully with all of its products.
DeleteWhat a shitshow, I should have opened short on TON, bummer
ReplyDeleteFinally! His BG and Telegram should be banned here in the West; no need of further russian propaganda and kremlin mouthpieces. Hosting russianeonazi such the rusich group and wagnerites is disgusting.
ReplyDeleteIsn't signal better?
ReplyDeleteThis makes me think the EU is batshit authoritarian over their so-called "free speech" that is nothing more than a hoax. This is not the actions of democratic nations, but of autocracies. This is contradicting the concept of freedom itself, and the ones cheering stuff like this are partially to blame and are part of the problem.
ReplyDeleteIt doesn't matter!
ReplyDeleteFreedom of speech and privacy should have a much higher priority than everything!
Draconian tactics for sure, they basically want to spy on everyone 24/7 which basically just drive criminal activities further underground, You shouldn't make the CEO responsible for how people chose to use their product. By that logic If A new Gun manufacturer's gun is used in a Schools shooting, the CEO is responsible and should be arrested for mass-murder. There will always be criminals, and spying on everyone will just create more criminals.
ReplyDeleteIn other news, Apple and Samsung CEOs arrested for conspiracy to facilitate terrorism, pedophilia and fraud enabled by their devices...
ReplyDeleteoutstanding move, france…
ReplyDeleteMost comments complain about the French... but it's being glossed over that Pavlov took this conscious decision, it has been done willingly. He must be trying to do something I cannot see through, like sparing his life from Russia or likewise
ReplyDeleteMistake landing? But could be wild if he want out of russia and this is the way he do it, but would he not have made a deal with cia/FBI first to be protected?
DeleteThat's fucking insane. Genuinely concerning.
ReplyDeleteWait, is this democracy and freedom of speech?) It’s especially funny that he was convicted under the same articles under which he was persecuted in Russia; as we see, France did not go far.)
ReplyDeleteFreedom of speech in the west (US excepted) is only for neo-liberals.
DeleteFreedom of speech, yeah. French government couldn’t do nothing better than that to justify Putin’s propaganda. Awful decision
ReplyDeleteWhy not just have a bit of moderation though? How is sharing CP & drugs justified at all? Is that what we are unintentionally promoting when we say "free media"?
ReplyDeleteI'm not supporting the arrest, but just curious to know.
Ulbricht 2.0
ReplyDeleteI am just very pleased to read that most here don't buy into the mass surveillance Europe is trying to force on their citizens.
ReplyDeleteHopefully we continue to stand strongly against it.
I've just read that that France is after sanctioning Telegram in EU. True?
ReplyDeleteThey want to use arrest as a case for it, yes
DeleteHave heard signal is were it's at, information for signal calls is far from clear and thus near impossible to be used by law enforcement
ReplyDeleteHe should know that if you sail the high seas you can't drop anchor in Port Royal. Or Port-au-Prince.
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
ReplyDeleteNO
DeleteTelegram has created a very large non believer group in the Netherlands who are shouting to kill all european leaders, who and wef.
ReplyDeleteTelegram does nothing to stop the misinformation on it's platform. It's 99% fake shit by bots and users fall into a Russian trap to destabilize the West.
But yeah show your support for an owner who openly lets the taliban, russia, IS, and many other terrorist organization use his platform to reach into the mind of your children!
It baffles me how people don't understand the limits of freedom. Selling drugs, and covering a bunch of other illegal stuff and not cooperating with the governments on that matter
DeleteSome people think because of freedom you also should give criminals the same free rights. Why do we even have prisons?
DeleteOoh it's the internet, that's different. /s
Good. Facilitating criminal activity on your platform under the guise of 'protecting free speech' is a bad thing, actually.
ReplyDeleteThis is a terrible miscarriage of justice. The Putin regime will one day pay for this suppression of freedom of spee.. oh sorry, he was arrested by French authorities? My bad.
ReplyDeleteI meant to say this criminal deserves to be arrested for enabling abuse of CHILDREN! Won't you think of the children?! I'm glad somebody is finally doing something about this deranged psychopath.
Pootin was in Azerbaijan, coincidence?
ReplyDeleteThis is more than a little crazy. France is off the rails with an unelected government...
ReplyDeleteWell at least they did not scramble jet fighters and land a passing plane, they politely waited until it lands!
ReplyDeleteNe
ReplyDeleteTelegram is not that private. Your data can be easily delivered to russian intelligence agencies by their requests.
ReplyDeleteDurov visited Azerbaijan to meet with putins people.
Holy shit. This app is a home to terrorist organisations and various rings, but also enables communication for basically all of Ukraine and lots of countries. It's a shame, shame, shame to try to arrest the CEO who is NOT welcome in Russia too. Even if the app has shady things like crypto or doesn't resonate well with copyright laws its substantial to resistance around the world.
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
ReplyDeleteSo time to arrest Musk too?
ReplyDeleteThe fascist authotarians are already in power in Europe and have been for a long time, of course, they call themselves anti-fascists and they justify their repression and control as a mean to protect democracy and safety but it is just a facade.
ReplyDeleteUsually the circlejerk of the sub is fully supportive of authoritarians from the EU because they cannot admit that the people and policies they supported were the real dangers, they thought the bad guys were "the others" while it was them.
Glad to see someone slowly realising their mistakes, sadly, it's too late, if you want freedoms you should run away from this continent, it's only gonna get worse.
Guys, chill out :) Durov will be okay, Telegram will be okay.
ReplyDeleteRussian soldiers that are communicating through Telegram should stop doing that i think. Or dont :)
it's real guys
ReplyDeleteThe government is bastards and nits
ReplyDeleteYou drove to court today yes? Yes
ReplyDeleteA green fiat merged into your lane, yes? I guess so, yes
You allowed this green car to merge and continue driving? Ehh yyeess?!
That car had drugs, you're an accomplice!!
What??
If he was using the platform to help support illegal activities and advocate for those activities going on - cough cough like Musk does with bigotry and hate groups on his platform - then yes charge him. But Telegram is pretty anti-illegal shit. It happens a lot sure, but I see a lot of that shit shot down FAST on channels I'm on that are for other subjects but you have someone trying to sell shit out of nowhere.
ReplyDeleteTelegram while not fully E2E, is a VERY popular source of more protected/safe messaging and data sharing. The absolute antithesis to what powerful governments want. Governments hate privacy and freedoms.
Also please don't compare to the pirate bay. I like places like that, but providing a host to illegal content in countries where it's illegal and not working to take down such data is and should be illegal lol. I support sailing the high seas but let's not act like it ain't illegal. That's DIFFERENT, than places that support legal sharing of data, or rom hacks that don't provide the roms, or video game system emulators for example. None of that is illegal, or just as illegal as duping a sauce and selling it like Walmart does lol. Which shouldn't be.
Pirate Bay doesn't host any illegal/copyrighted content... Telegram actually does.
DeleteThere will be no such thing as invading privacy, ever, no law shall apply
ReplyDeleteHope the freedom of speech remains among the high european values
ReplyDeleteLets arrest the ceo of vodafone for providing the tool of internet to criminals.
ReplyDeleteFucking insane.
Keep in mind that Vodafone and the likes are also mandated by law to provide information about their subscribers and they provide that info to law enforcement when asked. Telegram didn't.
DeleteAnd apple doesnt provide the fbi with tools to hack into iphones i dont see tim cook in prison?
DeleteTelegram wasn't asked for tools to hack into TG accounts. They were asked for data they already have and could share.
DeleteThat is hacking into encrypted data.
Delete